This is too funny...
Autobloggreen.com
Short version: "Our hybrid really isn't significantly better than our diesel, so we aren't going to bother with the trouble of selling it to you."
Europeans are smart, and they don't waste time with greenwashing... one drivetrain is just much simpler and more cost effective than two.
Showing posts with label lexus. Show all posts
Showing posts with label lexus. Show all posts
Monday, January 19, 2009
Wednesday, October 22, 2008
It's All In The Spin!
Earlier this week when I was looking around the lexus.ca website for the facts & figures used in the previous article I came across the "Lexus Hybrid Drive" section of the site with headings on "Benefits", "How It Works", and "Hybrid Myths". Some of it was well presented and honest, but a few "facts" were so rife with spin I got dizzy!
A few examples:
First... I hate anyone that justifies hybrids primarily by declaring them to be a statement!
Secondly, are the environmental benefits truly significant? As I brought out in my last article about Lexus, in the case of the GS450h, it only uses 4.6% less fuel than it's conventionally powered counterpart. That's hardly significant.
I will admit that it does indeed do so without sacrificing power though. After all, you've got 2 powertrains working together to do the work of one, so of course it will end up being more powerful.
But what about performance? Performance can be measured in a multitude of ways. Since we can assume that these 2 cars will be fitted with many (if not all) identical parts outside of the powertrain, that means "performance" in this case can be boiled down to two things: power, and weight (since the extra motor + the batteries to power it weigh a few hundred pounds).
-GS350
Horsepower: 303@6200
Torque: 274@3600
Weight: 3795
-GS450h
Horsepower: 340@6400
Torque: 267@4800
Weight: 4134
The hybrid does have a slightly better power to weight ratio, which means acceleration will be somewhat better. But since it weighs over 300 pounds more, braking and cornering will suffer. A lot!
It would be like having my ex-wife in the backseat all the time!
Next:
Yes I will agree that city driving with a hybrid uses a lot less fuel since you spend more time rolling on electric power, as well as having the benefits of start/stop (which conventional vehicles are soon starting to get).
But yet again... there's the word: significant. 4.6%... significant? Not in my opinion.
In the "Hybrid Myths" section:
The people at Lexus seem to have a very fluid perception of what "significant" means. A 4.6% savings in fuel consumption is "significant", yet a 38% increase in MSRP is "not nearly as significant as you might think".
How stupid does Lexus think their customers are?
As for benefiting from government rebates... here in Canada (after all, I'm reading lexus.ca) there is only one of the three Lexus hybrids that gets that rebate, which is a mere $1000 (on a $55,000 vehicle).
As for the claim that the 450h gets 25% better fuel economy than it's conventional cousin, the 430... it's true, but that's only because they are powered by two entirely different engines! The 430 is powered by a 4.3L V8, while the 450h is powered by a 3.5L V6! Lexus is comparing apples to oranges. There's 2 extra cylinders and nearly 25% difference in displacement between the 2 engines, so of course the bigger one would use more gasoline.
Compare apples to apples Lexus... conventional 3.5L V6 vs hybrid 3.5L V6.
But wait, you don't really want to do that because 4.6% isn't nearly as significant as 25%.
Sorry Lexus.... you've got some very nice looking vehicles, but your hybrids are not nearly as great as you proclaim them to be, and the lack of respect for your customer's intelligence is appalling!
If you want to read more of their nonsense and spin, feel free to visit their hybrid page for yourself.
A few examples:
A Powerful Statement
Lexus Hybrid Drive is an advanced gas-electric hybrid system that delivers significant environmental benefits without sacrificing power or performance.
First... I hate anyone that justifies hybrids primarily by declaring them to be a statement!
Secondly, are the environmental benefits truly significant? As I brought out in my last article about Lexus, in the case of the GS450h, it only uses 4.6% less fuel than it's conventionally powered counterpart. That's hardly significant.
I will admit that it does indeed do so without sacrificing power though. After all, you've got 2 powertrains working together to do the work of one, so of course it will end up being more powerful.
But what about performance? Performance can be measured in a multitude of ways. Since we can assume that these 2 cars will be fitted with many (if not all) identical parts outside of the powertrain, that means "performance" in this case can be boiled down to two things: power, and weight (since the extra motor + the batteries to power it weigh a few hundred pounds).
-GS350
Horsepower: 303@6200
Torque: 274@3600
Weight: 3795
-GS450h
Horsepower: 340@6400
Torque: 267@4800
Weight: 4134
The hybrid does have a slightly better power to weight ratio, which means acceleration will be somewhat better. But since it weighs over 300 pounds more, braking and cornering will suffer. A lot!
It would be like having my ex-wife in the backseat all the time!
Next:
Lexus Hybrid Drive vehicles are significantly more efficient than their non-hybrid counterparts. While fuel consumption is lower for both city and highway driving, city driving requires less fuel because the electric motors are often used exclusively at low speeds.
Yes I will agree that city driving with a hybrid uses a lot less fuel since you spend more time rolling on electric power, as well as having the benefits of start/stop (which conventional vehicles are soon starting to get).
But yet again... there's the word: significant. 4.6%... significant? Not in my opinion.
In the "Hybrid Myths" section:
Hybrids Cost An Arm And a Leg
There is an initial added cost outlay, but it's not nearly as significant as you might think. You'll also benefit from available government rebates, reduced service costs and fuel savings. The Lexus GS 450h gets almost 25% better fuel-economy than its conventional cousin, the GS 430.
The people at Lexus seem to have a very fluid perception of what "significant" means. A 4.6% savings in fuel consumption is "significant", yet a 38% increase in MSRP is "not nearly as significant as you might think".
How stupid does Lexus think their customers are?
As for benefiting from government rebates... here in Canada (after all, I'm reading lexus.ca) there is only one of the three Lexus hybrids that gets that rebate, which is a mere $1000 (on a $55,000 vehicle).
As for the claim that the 450h gets 25% better fuel economy than it's conventional cousin, the 430... it's true, but that's only because they are powered by two entirely different engines! The 430 is powered by a 4.3L V8, while the 450h is powered by a 3.5L V6! Lexus is comparing apples to oranges. There's 2 extra cylinders and nearly 25% difference in displacement between the 2 engines, so of course the bigger one would use more gasoline.
Compare apples to apples Lexus... conventional 3.5L V6 vs hybrid 3.5L V6.
But wait, you don't really want to do that because 4.6% isn't nearly as significant as 25%.
Sorry Lexus.... you've got some very nice looking vehicles, but your hybrids are not nearly as great as you proclaim them to be, and the lack of respect for your customer's intelligence is appalling!
If you want to read more of their nonsense and spin, feel free to visit their hybrid page for yourself.
Tuesday, October 7, 2008
Lexus Says "Hybrids Aren't Just a Transition Technology"
"They are here to stay."So claims Andy Pfeiffenberger, the head of Lexus Europe. Perhaps in the future things will be different, but in their current state, hybrids are nothing more than a band-aid. And if what they have now is all they have to offer, Toyota/Lexus is in a very sad state.
For starters, hybrids as we know them now do very little to reduce our dependency on fossil fuels. The fact is, they still need gasoline to run. Sure they may use a bit less, but like I said... they're just a band-aid. Hybrids on our roads today are doing little to wean us off gasoline, and nothing to promote alternative energy solutions.
Just look at the hybrid offerings from Lexus themselves:
The GS450h is the hybrid version of the GS350. The 350 is powered by a 3.5L V6 and gets a combined EPA rating of 10.7L/100kms (22mpg). The GS450h is powered by the same 3.5L V6 (I wonder where they got the 450 nomenclature from?) but with the addition of the electric motor puts out a few more horsepower, while consuming 10.2L/100kms (23mpg).*
That's a grand total of 4.6% improvement in fuel efficiency! (And don't forget that they both need Premium pump gas too...)
Wow!!
That figure is even more amazing when you factor in the price. What does the privilege of 4.6% improvement in fuel economy cost you? Try $11,250 in the United States, or $18,200 in Canada!**
Let's do the math on that:
In the USA it will cost you about 25% more to save 4.6% on gas.
In Canada it will cost you over 34% more to save 4.6% on gas.
Andy Pfeiffenberger had better hope Toyota/Lexus can come up with something much better than that if they truly believe that hybrids aren't just a transition technology and really are here to stay.
*Fuel economy figures taken from fueleconomy.org.
**Price differentials based on MSRP, taken from lexus.com and lexus.ca respectively.
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